Internet Goosing the Antithesis

Friday, November 04, 2005

Presuppositionalism, Roman style

Another IM conversation in the Roman States of America. What happens when Vesta turns presup...


NoGods : Oh hey, what's up ? Still holding on to the old Roman/Greek myths ?
Vesta29 : They're not myths, they're historical ! Anyway, I'm a presuppositionalist now.
NoGods : Presa what ?
Vesta29 : Presuppositionalist.
NoGods : What the Hades does that mean ?
Vesta29 : It means that I believe in the gods because they are necessary for the existence of logic, science and morality.
NoGods : Um... why ? The gods didn't have anything to do with it.
Vesta29 : Prometheus brought fire to man, which brought us heat, cooking, protection...
NoGods : Using the GREEK myths again, huh ?
Vesta29 : IT'S THE SAME THING ! Stop bringing up the Greek argument ! Anyway, without Prometheus we wouldn't have any science.
NoGods : And ah... you know he exists because the myths say so, right ?
Vesta29 : Right.
NoGods : Well I don't believe in them.
Vesta29 : All right, so how did we get the intricate harmony of natural law ?
NoGods : Let me guess... the deities move each part of nature according to their role.
Vesta29 : Exactly !
NoGods : Uh... no. We can measure and understand how natural laws work without using the notion of deities.
Vesta29 : Yes, but where do they come from ?
NoGods : They don't "come from" anywhere. They are our way of understanding how things change. They exist in their particular way because things exist in their particular way.
Vesta29 : Yea, but see, without the deities all it is, is matter in motion. It wouldn't have any laws. The deities mold the flow of matter into the Forms desired by the gods.
NoGods : That's fucking stupid.
Vesta29 : AHA ! See, you can't answer !
NoGods : Listen, in science it's just matter in motion, but we still can explain perfectly how the natural laws arise from its nature.
Vesta29 : There are many things you still can't explain ! Like how you know right from wrong ! Or how there is so much design in the universe.
NoGods : We know right from wrong because evolution gave us the means to deal with a primitive environment, and we figure out the rest ourselves. And there is no design in the universe.
Vesta29 : Yes there is !
NoGods : Then how come there are natural disasters and evil ?
Vesta29 : The gods are like us, they quarrel and dispute, they make mistakes like we do. So naturally there will always be problems with their domain. That's what happens when you design by committee.
NoGods : Yea, that makes some sense... but still an inferior explanation compared to the scientific one.
Vesta29 : But superior to the one of any other religion. Like monotheism for example : why would a single, infinite, clear-headed god create evil ? That's ridiculous !
NoGods : Yea, I have to agree about that one. Pantheonism makes more sense.
Vesta29 : And what about morality ? We know that pederastry is right and adultery is wrong because the myths tell us so. Instead of lusting after boys as they should, men would go around coveting their neighbour's wife...
NoGods : Um, Ares was not punished after committing adultery with Aphrodite, just humiliated.
Vesta29 : Yea, and that's bad. You shouldn't want to be humiliated. So that's where morality comes from.
NoGods : Not wanting to be humiliated is a natural emotional desire. Nothing to do with the gods.
Vesta29 : But the gods gave us that want.
NoGods : No they didn't. Evolution did.
Vesta29 : The gods !
NoGods : Evolution !
Vesta29 : The gods !
NoGods : Evolution !
Vesta29 : Evolution !
NoGods : The gods ! Ah dammit. You got me there.
Vesta29 : Yea, I sure did.
NoGods : In conclusion, you're wrong.
Vesta29 : No, listen. Did you know they found the Argo during an expedition under the Mediterranean ? That means the myths are all 100% true !
NoGods : Good grief.

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At 11/04/2005 11:34 AM, Blogger Aaron Kinney declaimed...

Pantheism makes alot more sense than monotheism! LOL!



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